Showing posts with label Survey. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Survey. Show all posts
Thursday, September 06, 2007
Gay Customers Don't Want Their Bars to Be Like Straight Bars
A few more interesting things from our Faces online survey for us to think about...and for every straight bar owner who was thinking they could throw together a "gay night" on a slow night to empty gay pockets...84.2% of our survey respondents do not want gay bars to be like straight bars. Eighty-nine percent think that gay bars are an important part of our community...ninety percent think that gay bars give them a place to be themselves...80% said it was important for the bars that they patronize to support AIDS service organizations...70% said it was important that their bars support St. Louis Pridefest....67% said it was important for their bars to offer HIV testing and safe sex material...77% said it was important that their bars support gay owned publications like EXP and Vital Voice...and 90% said that whenever possible they try to support gay owned businesses. One remark we would like to add...there are many straight owned bars and restaurants that support AIDS service organizations...some support Pridefest..and a few advertise in gay owned publications (and quite a few gay bars have abandoned these publications yet they still get support from the community)...those businesses that reach out to us deserve the support and thanks of our community. We are not aware of any straight bars that offer HIV testing or safe sex material, which is kind of odd since straight people have sex too.
Wednesday, September 05, 2007
SurveyYields Surprising Results - You Love Us...You Really, Really Love Us!
Many of you have been writing us to ask about our plans and we thought it might be time for an update. Thank you again to everyone who took the time to complete our online survey. We think you'll find the results interesting if not surprising. First a disclaimer...our online survey was not scientific...it was open to anyone who wanted to complete it...we relied on your honesty..we hope that your answers were serious and thoughtful... we have no way of knowing if the survey respondents have ever actually been to Faces. We realize that some of our customers do not have computers and some, angry about the length of the survey did not complete it. We realize that some respondents had their own personal agendas but we think the numbers are an accurate snapshot of what St. Louis club-goers are thinking now. While some of the responses have left us scratching our heads...they seem inconsistent with the facts...they have given us all a lot to think about. We encourage you to share the results with your friends and let us know how you interpret the numbers.
Some good news for Faces on Fourth Street...80.2% of our respondents agreed that they found " the raw, sexually charged atmosphere at Faces appealing."
Ninety-one percent said that "it is important that St. Louis has a bar like Faces." Sixty-two percent told us that they "were satisfied with the club experience at Faces on Fourth Street." Ninety-three percent thought it was important that St. Louis have an after-hours gay bar.
Fifty-two percent said that "Faces on Fourth Street is my favorite gay/alternative club in the St. Louis area."
Eighty-nine percent were "sorry to hear that Faces on Fourth Street closed."
Sixty percent said that they like the music the DJs play at Faces more then other gay bars. Sixty-one percent said they were more likely to go to a gay bar that had a drag show, 72 % said they enjoy watching drag shows, and 62.7% said Faces should have more drag shows in the cabaret.
Some bad news for St. Louis gay bars...in fact a lot of bad news....while 89.7% agree that gay bars are an important part of our community and 90% said that gay bars give them a place to be themselves, only 39.9 % of our respondents are satisfied with nightlife in St. Louis. Seventy-six percent wished there were more gay bars in St. Louis. Fifty-six percent said they were going out to gay bars less then they had a year ago while 35.9% said they were going to gay bars less often because they were not happy with St. Louis gay bars. because they weren't happy. When asked to name an event or entertainment held at a St. Louis gay bar (other then Faces) that they enjoyed, more then half could not name a single event..those that did answer were frequently vague, offering general answers like drag shows or New Year's Eve without even specifying what bar they were talking about.
A few more surprising things from our survey...62% of our respondents have MySpace pages...52% have Gay.com profiles...24% were 31-35 years old...36% were 21-31 years old...9% were 18-21...and 31% were over 35 years old.
We will post more survey results in the future. We'd like you to take some time to digest and consider these results just as we are evaluating them. What does it mean that our customers like the Faces atmosphere, like our music, like drag shows, and think of us as their favorite gay bar at the same time we were forced to close our doors due to increasing expenses and declining attendance? What does it mean when a huge majority of respondents are not happy with St. Louis gay bars, wish there were more bar choices, but did not support the alternative that Faces offered?
Does the survey offer a clear path for Faces to take in the future....unfortunately, no...every Faces event listed on the survey was met with similar answers....large majorities who had been to our events, from foam parties to U Can Dance liked them...but the majority of our survey respondents had never been to one of these events...everyone who came, liked them...had a great time..but that word-of-mouth didn't persuade more to come....the most popular events on the survey, our Lights Out/Underwear Parties and our male dancers have drawn little or no crowds in the last few months. Over 60% of the survey respondents thought they knew all about events happening at Faces before they walked in the door, but our own anecdotal experience is just the opposite. Many of the survey essay answers seemed to reinforce that..often complaining about policies or conditions that have not existed in years...suggesting that we try things that we have already been doing consistently for years...We found it increasingly difficult to communicate with or reach our potential customers and that condition has not changed.
We are taking time to consider your answers...to study the gay club scene in St. Louis..to look at our mistakes...and to consider where we can fit into your life in the future. We don't have an answer yet. We have considered re-opening on weekends only...we have considered opening just one floor...we have considered gutting the building and starting from scratch...we have considered mothballing the club until we can determine there is a need..a demand for what we can offer. We took the summer off because we felt we could not sustain the utility bills that more then doubled this year. We hoped that the Illinois Legislature would act to rollback and freeze utility rates but they failed...our electric rates will continue to rise with no relief. We feel that the legislature has let down the people of Illinois.
For now...thank you for your support..please consider the survey results and share your thoughts with us.
Some good news for Faces on Fourth Street...80.2% of our respondents agreed that they found " the raw, sexually charged atmosphere at Faces appealing."
Ninety-one percent said that "it is important that St. Louis has a bar like Faces." Sixty-two percent told us that they "were satisfied with the club experience at Faces on Fourth Street." Ninety-three percent thought it was important that St. Louis have an after-hours gay bar.
Fifty-two percent said that "Faces on Fourth Street is my favorite gay/alternative club in the St. Louis area."
Eighty-nine percent were "sorry to hear that Faces on Fourth Street closed."
Sixty percent said that they like the music the DJs play at Faces more then other gay bars. Sixty-one percent said they were more likely to go to a gay bar that had a drag show, 72 % said they enjoy watching drag shows, and 62.7% said Faces should have more drag shows in the cabaret.
Some bad news for St. Louis gay bars...in fact a lot of bad news....while 89.7% agree that gay bars are an important part of our community and 90% said that gay bars give them a place to be themselves, only 39.9 % of our respondents are satisfied with nightlife in St. Louis. Seventy-six percent wished there were more gay bars in St. Louis. Fifty-six percent said they were going out to gay bars less then they had a year ago while 35.9% said they were going to gay bars less often because they were not happy with St. Louis gay bars. because they weren't happy. When asked to name an event or entertainment held at a St. Louis gay bar (other then Faces) that they enjoyed, more then half could not name a single event..those that did answer were frequently vague, offering general answers like drag shows or New Year's Eve without even specifying what bar they were talking about.
A few more surprising things from our survey...62% of our respondents have MySpace pages...52% have Gay.com profiles...24% were 31-35 years old...36% were 21-31 years old...9% were 18-21...and 31% were over 35 years old.
We will post more survey results in the future. We'd like you to take some time to digest and consider these results just as we are evaluating them. What does it mean that our customers like the Faces atmosphere, like our music, like drag shows, and think of us as their favorite gay bar at the same time we were forced to close our doors due to increasing expenses and declining attendance? What does it mean when a huge majority of respondents are not happy with St. Louis gay bars, wish there were more bar choices, but did not support the alternative that Faces offered?
Does the survey offer a clear path for Faces to take in the future....unfortunately, no...every Faces event listed on the survey was met with similar answers....large majorities who had been to our events, from foam parties to U Can Dance liked them...but the majority of our survey respondents had never been to one of these events...everyone who came, liked them...had a great time..but that word-of-mouth didn't persuade more to come....the most popular events on the survey, our Lights Out/Underwear Parties and our male dancers have drawn little or no crowds in the last few months. Over 60% of the survey respondents thought they knew all about events happening at Faces before they walked in the door, but our own anecdotal experience is just the opposite. Many of the survey essay answers seemed to reinforce that..often complaining about policies or conditions that have not existed in years...suggesting that we try things that we have already been doing consistently for years...We found it increasingly difficult to communicate with or reach our potential customers and that condition has not changed.
We are taking time to consider your answers...to study the gay club scene in St. Louis..to look at our mistakes...and to consider where we can fit into your life in the future. We don't have an answer yet. We have considered re-opening on weekends only...we have considered opening just one floor...we have considered gutting the building and starting from scratch...we have considered mothballing the club until we can determine there is a need..a demand for what we can offer. We took the summer off because we felt we could not sustain the utility bills that more then doubled this year. We hoped that the Illinois Legislature would act to rollback and freeze utility rates but they failed...our electric rates will continue to rise with no relief. We feel that the legislature has let down the people of Illinois.
For now...thank you for your support..please consider the survey results and share your thoughts with us.
Wednesday, May 23, 2007
Tuesday, May 22, 2007
Location, Location,Location - Some Early Thoughts on Our Survey Results
You can still tell us what you think of St. Louis' nightlife. You can tell us what direction you think Faces should take in the future. Our online survey is still open and we are still listening. Some of you wrote to us with concerns about the survey, we listened, and we tried to re-organize it to make it easier to complete. The survey is anonymous. we cannot track who completed it or link specific answerers to specific people. We aren't collecting information to use against you or hurt you. We know the survey is long. We felt that we only had one opportunity to ask your questions so we asked as much as we felt we needed to know. We hope you will take advantage of the opportunity to give us your thoughts and concerns and not use the survey to engage in personal attacks. The survey questions must be completed in order..you can't cherry pick the questions you want to answer because the survey will display an error message if you skip questions. There are questions that do not require an answer but you will find that out as you answer the questions. We thank you for taking the time to complete our survey.
There is a danger in talking about a survey while people are still completing it. Sometimes the results of the survey can unintentionally change because of what someone says.
With that in mind, we will try to confine our early comments to some of the more anecdotal comments rather then the actual numbers.
One topic that has come up in the open ended (essay) answers to some of our questions can be classified as "location, location, location". Some of our survey respondents have suggested that the answer to Faces problems is to move...to move from East St. Louis...to move to someplace "closer to the other bars", to move to St. Louis. All options are on the table at this point. No idea is being thrown out. We have considered the idea of moving. With that preface, we'd like to give you something to think about. Faces has served St. Louis in the same location for nearly 30 years. Many of those 30 years were booming times, with large crowds partying until dawn. Tens of thousands of people have patronized Faces in East St. Louis. To move from East St. Louis would mean to end our ability to be an after-hours nightclub. There are a handful of communities in Illinois that allow bars to be open and serve drinks all night. None of those communities are particularly desirable or entirely safe.
Gay bars in general are not in the best parts of town, even the ones in St. Louis. Drive (we would not advise walking) a block in any direction from the Manchester strip and you will probably not feel safe. Park under the unlit overpass by the local leather bar and tell us how fast you run to the bar's front door. Drive a few blocks north, south, or east of the CWE and see how many stop signs you run to get to safety. The fact is that people don't like to live next to nightclubs. Bars and nightclubs are noisy, they generate traffic late at night, trash (beer bottles), the customers take up parking, they frequently make noise and get into trouble as the bars close. To get a liquor license in St. Louis, a potential bar owner has to go through a costly and often difficult ritual of obtaining signatures of approval from all their neighbors. In areas that already have bars, like the Manchester Strip, existing bars can and frequently do block new bars from opening by withholding their approval. One unfriendly neighbor can prevent any bars from opening nearby. Gay bars are even more controversial. Even if a gay bar owner were able to meet all the requirements to get a license, communities can block them or get them closed down quickly by enforcing obscure laws like ones that were used for years to run gays out of the CWE by requiring bars with dancing to get a special license and making it a law that dancing could not be visible from the street. Missouri's liquor laws are very different. St. Louis' rules are very different on your behavior as well as what is acceptable entertainment. There is a reason that none of St. Louis' gay bars have strippers. Two stories may help illustrate the point. After a very popular lesbian/girl's bar opened in St. Louis, they were busted by St. Louis Liquor Control and forced to shut down because a customer who had just had her nipple pierced, exposed her breast to another customer to show the piercing. While this was in no way the bar's fault, the bar was closed for a period of time as punishment.
The former manager of a popular St. Louis gay dance bar told me the story of how his bar had hosted an event where the bar staff was dressed in swim wear. Liquor control was prepared to bust the bar and the bar staff for wearing underwear in the bar until the manager proved that they were wearing swim wear. He told me that they have gotten in trouble for customers on their dance floor even showing pubic hair or a brief bare butt. They must monitor their customers behavior with security cameras to insure that no one gets carried away and drops their pants on the dance floor and to insure that any PDA does not become too hot and heavy. He also explained that they had to monitor their ambient video..the videos sent by record companies and gay marketing companies because they were not allowed to show video with nudity or simulated sex in St. Louis bars. A popular leather/bear bar always includes a disclaimer in their event ads stating that costumes worn must be "street legal".
While some might argue that this is a good thing, making gay bars PG-13, the majority of our survey respondents do not agree. We have been able to provide the entertainment that we did because of our location.
We would not be able to stay open and serve all night in Missouri. Our location allows us to continue the party all night long.
Is our location really so far off the beaten path? Mapquest states that we are 6.1 miles from Freddie's, 5.3 miles from JJ's, 5.1 miles from The Complex, 2.84 miles from Busch Stadium, and 2.3 miles from Rue 13. We are probably closer to major highway on and off ramps then any other gay bar. We are a block from the police station, a block from an SIU branch, a few blocks from the Federal Courts building, and a few blocks from a thriving and expanding casino.
We agree that when you go to any other bar, you need to be careful. Don't talk to strangers outside. Don't loiter outside. Don't leave valuables in your car. and park near the crowd, not on some desolate street. That is all just basic common sense. Anyplace that attracts large groups of people with money is also an attraction for bad people. We want every customer to have a safe experience at Faces. We are always reviewing our customers security needs and have made adjustments to keep you safe. Some things are beyond our control. We don't own the parking lot across the street. We think it is the safest place to park because it is lit and visible from the Metrolink station as well as our front door. When everyone parks in the same area, it is easier to watch. Unfortunately, customers still park blocks away, on dark side streets or behind the abandoned Spivey Building and we frankly don't know how to discourage that. We have noticed this same problem on the Manchester Strip. When customers park further from the center of things, on those dark side streets, they are frequently preyed upon. The Manchester Strip continues to wrestle with the problem every day just like we do.
When we bought Faces 14 years ago, we accepted the fact that there were some people who would never patronize our bar. East St. Louis' reputation for lawlessness over the past century has been passed down from generation to generation. East St. Louis had a reputation of being controlled by mob bosses as far back as prohibition. We realize that for many, their minds are made up and they will never drive over, no matter what we do. So, our goal has been to cater to, to market to those who were adventureous, to those will to take a walk on the wild side, to those willing to leave their comfort zone for something different, for something more. it has been a trade-off. If customers want cutting edeg, raw, adult entertainment..if they want strippers, slightly raunchy theme parties, all night dancing, and events like lube wrestling, then they usually find their way to Faces.
Here is the lnk to the survey:
Click here to take survey
There is a danger in talking about a survey while people are still completing it. Sometimes the results of the survey can unintentionally change because of what someone says.
With that in mind, we will try to confine our early comments to some of the more anecdotal comments rather then the actual numbers.
One topic that has come up in the open ended (essay) answers to some of our questions can be classified as "location, location, location". Some of our survey respondents have suggested that the answer to Faces problems is to move...to move from East St. Louis...to move to someplace "closer to the other bars", to move to St. Louis. All options are on the table at this point. No idea is being thrown out. We have considered the idea of moving. With that preface, we'd like to give you something to think about. Faces has served St. Louis in the same location for nearly 30 years. Many of those 30 years were booming times, with large crowds partying until dawn. Tens of thousands of people have patronized Faces in East St. Louis. To move from East St. Louis would mean to end our ability to be an after-hours nightclub. There are a handful of communities in Illinois that allow bars to be open and serve drinks all night. None of those communities are particularly desirable or entirely safe.
Gay bars in general are not in the best parts of town, even the ones in St. Louis. Drive (we would not advise walking) a block in any direction from the Manchester strip and you will probably not feel safe. Park under the unlit overpass by the local leather bar and tell us how fast you run to the bar's front door. Drive a few blocks north, south, or east of the CWE and see how many stop signs you run to get to safety. The fact is that people don't like to live next to nightclubs. Bars and nightclubs are noisy, they generate traffic late at night, trash (beer bottles), the customers take up parking, they frequently make noise and get into trouble as the bars close. To get a liquor license in St. Louis, a potential bar owner has to go through a costly and often difficult ritual of obtaining signatures of approval from all their neighbors. In areas that already have bars, like the Manchester Strip, existing bars can and frequently do block new bars from opening by withholding their approval. One unfriendly neighbor can prevent any bars from opening nearby. Gay bars are even more controversial. Even if a gay bar owner were able to meet all the requirements to get a license, communities can block them or get them closed down quickly by enforcing obscure laws like ones that were used for years to run gays out of the CWE by requiring bars with dancing to get a special license and making it a law that dancing could not be visible from the street. Missouri's liquor laws are very different. St. Louis' rules are very different on your behavior as well as what is acceptable entertainment. There is a reason that none of St. Louis' gay bars have strippers. Two stories may help illustrate the point. After a very popular lesbian/girl's bar opened in St. Louis, they were busted by St. Louis Liquor Control and forced to shut down because a customer who had just had her nipple pierced, exposed her breast to another customer to show the piercing. While this was in no way the bar's fault, the bar was closed for a period of time as punishment.
The former manager of a popular St. Louis gay dance bar told me the story of how his bar had hosted an event where the bar staff was dressed in swim wear. Liquor control was prepared to bust the bar and the bar staff for wearing underwear in the bar until the manager proved that they were wearing swim wear. He told me that they have gotten in trouble for customers on their dance floor even showing pubic hair or a brief bare butt. They must monitor their customers behavior with security cameras to insure that no one gets carried away and drops their pants on the dance floor and to insure that any PDA does not become too hot and heavy. He also explained that they had to monitor their ambient video..the videos sent by record companies and gay marketing companies because they were not allowed to show video with nudity or simulated sex in St. Louis bars. A popular leather/bear bar always includes a disclaimer in their event ads stating that costumes worn must be "street legal".
While some might argue that this is a good thing, making gay bars PG-13, the majority of our survey respondents do not agree. We have been able to provide the entertainment that we did because of our location.
We would not be able to stay open and serve all night in Missouri. Our location allows us to continue the party all night long.
Is our location really so far off the beaten path? Mapquest states that we are 6.1 miles from Freddie's, 5.3 miles from JJ's, 5.1 miles from The Complex, 2.84 miles from Busch Stadium, and 2.3 miles from Rue 13. We are probably closer to major highway on and off ramps then any other gay bar. We are a block from the police station, a block from an SIU branch, a few blocks from the Federal Courts building, and a few blocks from a thriving and expanding casino.
We agree that when you go to any other bar, you need to be careful. Don't talk to strangers outside. Don't loiter outside. Don't leave valuables in your car. and park near the crowd, not on some desolate street. That is all just basic common sense. Anyplace that attracts large groups of people with money is also an attraction for bad people. We want every customer to have a safe experience at Faces. We are always reviewing our customers security needs and have made adjustments to keep you safe. Some things are beyond our control. We don't own the parking lot across the street. We think it is the safest place to park because it is lit and visible from the Metrolink station as well as our front door. When everyone parks in the same area, it is easier to watch. Unfortunately, customers still park blocks away, on dark side streets or behind the abandoned Spivey Building and we frankly don't know how to discourage that. We have noticed this same problem on the Manchester Strip. When customers park further from the center of things, on those dark side streets, they are frequently preyed upon. The Manchester Strip continues to wrestle with the problem every day just like we do.
When we bought Faces 14 years ago, we accepted the fact that there were some people who would never patronize our bar. East St. Louis' reputation for lawlessness over the past century has been passed down from generation to generation. East St. Louis had a reputation of being controlled by mob bosses as far back as prohibition. We realize that for many, their minds are made up and they will never drive over, no matter what we do. So, our goal has been to cater to, to market to those who were adventureous, to those will to take a walk on the wild side, to those willing to leave their comfort zone for something different, for something more. it has been a trade-off. If customers want cutting edeg, raw, adult entertainment..if they want strippers, slightly raunchy theme parties, all night dancing, and events like lube wrestling, then they usually find their way to Faces.
Here is the lnk to the survey:
Click here to take survey
Thursday, May 03, 2007
We're Listening & Want to Hear From You!
Faces on Fourth Street needs your help. We're interested in what
you have to say about St. Louis nightlife, gay bars, what you
think is important, what you would never change, and what you'd like to see at Faces on Fourth Street in the future. Please take a few minutes to complete this survey.
Thank You From Faces on Fourth Street
Click here to take survey
you have to say about St. Louis nightlife, gay bars, what you
think is important, what you would never change, and what you'd like to see at Faces on Fourth Street in the future. Please take a few minutes to complete this survey.
Thank You From Faces on Fourth Street
Click here to take survey
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